Maybe this Groupon deal wasn’t a deal after all

auremar/Shutterstock
auremar/Shutterstock
Groupon is a bargain website that promises daily deals and “unbelievable” customer service. But Stuart Lord says he got neither when he bought a VIP wine package in California’s Sonoma Valley — a deal he later discovered was significantly overpriced.

Here are the specifics: The offer was for two people for two nights at the Sonoma Valley Inn and two “VIP” wine tastings. Total price: $169.

“The advertisement said it was worth $320 — a 47 percent discount,” he remembers.

Only, it wasn’t.

“When I used this Groupon to book the room for late January, however, I discovered that the hotel’s rate was $89 per night and that, had I used my AAA discount, it would have been $83 per night,” he says. “To add insult to deception, a few weeks later, Groupon sent me an offer for the same room at $59.”

And the wine tasting tour? It didn’t measure up, either. “It turned out to be little more than regular wine tastings, which often were comped if one bought wine or found one of the many discounts in many of the local tourist magazines,” says Lord.

Did Groupon overpromise?

Even though I haven’t purchased anything on Groupon, other members of my household have. Their experiences have been largely positive, so I assumed that when Lord followed up with the company, it would find a way to address his concerns.

It did — but not to his satisfaction. When he sent it a brief, polite email questioning the price, here’s the reply:

Sorry for any confusion. It is never our intention to mislead anyone about the value of a Groupon.

The value and discount percentage listed on each deal reflect the regular full price for that product or service. If the business offers other temporary discounts or decides to change their standard pricing after their deal is featured, the relative savings and value might change.

Unfortunately, we cannot foresee or control these changes. That said, we work very hard to make sure that the deals we feature are the best in town.

I wasn’t happy with that answer either because it failed to address two key problems. First, the fact that the room at the Sonoma Valley Inn appeared to be “discounted” from its rack rate, or list price, which made the discount look significantly higher than it was; and second, the fact that the VIP wine tasting was more or less worthless.

Groupon responds

I thought Groupon could do better than the form response, so I asked. Here’s the detailed explanation:

As I’m sure you’re aware, travel industry pricing can fluctuate based on a variety of factors, including time of year, level of availability, day of the week, etc.

We work very closely with vendors at the time the deal is created to ensure we are working with the most accurate rates and bringing the best discount possible to our customers.

The first deal in question was offered in November for a travel window of November through February. The second deal was offered in December for a travel window of January through April.

Regular un-discounted pricing, particularly for rooms booked in the time period of the second deal, varied by more than $100 depending on options selected. It is worth noting that the merchant sets the average discount across the travel window so some nights might have a 50 percent discount while others might have a 30 percent discount, and that’s the nature of the industry.

Our platform complements the merchant’s established pricing by allowing the merchant to often offer a better discount than would normally be possible, but in the end, it is the merchant that sets the advertised price versus what they can charge per room.

We do our best to ensure to our customers that the pricing established by the merchant is accurate and we’re confident we’re still providing enormous value to our subscribers.

It’s also worth noting that we do not value room nights and deals relative to AAA rates, since AAA requires an exclusive membership.

OK, that’s better, but not exactly reassuring. It appears Groupon is giving its “merchants” the ability to play pricing games with discounts which may or may not amount to real savings, and without any accountability. Lord was hoping Groupon would say, “You’re right, this isn’t a real deal,” and offer some money back or a credit.

I don’t know if I would have pushed for that. After all, pricing in the hotel industry can be mercurial. But it would have been nice for Groupon to take a little more responsibility for a deal that wasn’t really much of a deal, at least as far as this customer was concerned.

Did Stuart Lord get a deal from Groupon?

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  • Curly

    He may not have gotten the deal of the century, but it’s the buyer’s responsibility to check out the hotel’s website before buying! It couldn’t be easier. I do find that I buy groupons impulsively, but so far I”m way ahead. My biggest problem has been not using them before they expire.

  • Curly

    He may not have gotten the deal of the century, but it’s the buyer’s responsibility to check out the hotel’s website before buying! It couldn’t be easier. I do find that I buy groupons impulsively, but so far I”m way ahead. My biggest problem has been not using them before they expire.

  • http://www.facebook.com/CarverFarrow Carver Clark Farrow

    What would you have Groupon say? VIP is a completely subjective term. What’s VIP to me might be crap to you.

  • http://www.facebook.com/CarverFarrow Carver Clark Farrow

    What would you have Groupon say? VIP is a completely subjective term. What’s VIP to me might be crap to you.

  • http://www.facebook.com/CarverFarrow Carver Clark Farrow

    I was going to respond to Tamara’s post, but your’s was better than anything I could come up with

  • http://www.facebook.com/CarverFarrow Carver Clark Farrow

    I was going to respond to Tamara’s post, but your’s was better than anything I could come up with

  • http://www.facebook.com/CarverFarrow Carver Clark Farrow

    AH, my error, I thought it was New York. Thanks

  • http://www.facebook.com/CarverFarrow Carver Clark Farrow

    AH, my error, I thought it was New York. Thanks

  • EdB

    What I would like to know is if the wine tasting was just the standard offering that was just relabeled as VIP or was there a special offering they were suppose to get but didn’t.

  • EdB

    What I would like to know is if the wine tasting was just the standard offering that was just relabeled as VIP or was there a special offering they were suppose to get but didn’t.

  • http://www.facebook.com/CarverFarrow Carver Clark Farrow

    So I took a quick class at the URL you posted. Your statements are contrary to the black letter law.

    THe FTC site specifically states that the fact that no sales occured does not necessarily break the law. What is relevant is that the price is indeed offered regularly offered to the public during the course of business.

    To quote

    “b) A former price is not necessarily fictitious merely because no sales at the advertised price were made. …that the price is one at which the product was openly and actively offered for sale, for a reasonably substantial period of time, in the recent, regular course of his business, honestly and in good faith”

  • http://www.facebook.com/CarverFarrow Carver Clark Farrow

    So I took a quick class at the URL you posted. Your statements are contrary to the black letter law.

    THe FTC site specifically states that the fact that no sales occured does not necessarily break the law. What is relevant is that the price is indeed offered regularly offered to the public during the course of business.

    To quote

    “b) A former price is not necessarily fictitious merely because no sales at the advertised price were made. …that the price is one at which the product was openly and actively offered for sale, for a reasonably substantial period of time, in the recent, regular course of his business, honestly and in good faith”

  • http://www.facebook.com/CarverFarrow Carver Clark Farrow

    Probably the former. To most people, labeling something as Deluxe, VIP, etc, implies that there is a standard, non-Deluxe, non-VIP, offering to measure these terms against. Unfortunately, that is not legally required.

  • http://www.facebook.com/CarverFarrow Carver Clark Farrow

    Probably the former. To most people, labeling something as Deluxe, VIP, etc, implies that there is a standard, non-Deluxe, non-VIP, offering to measure these terms against. Unfortunately, that is not legally required.

  • technomage1

    Really? there’s more to the law than just the paragraph you’ve stated. OK then, I offer my spare room for $1M a night. I’ll wait a week, then drop the price to $100 a night. Now, I’ve offered the $1M a night in good faith. No one (I hope) would be insane enough to pay it so my room was unused. Does that mean I can advertise the room as “discounted” at whatever % $100 is of $1M? No, because comparable rooms like mine don’t go for nearly $1M a night in the area. Or any other, most likely.

    (If anyone does want to pay $1M to stay in my spare room, please contact me immediately. We can work something out).

    Though I’ve backed off the “flat illegal” of it (see comments further down) this type of comparison pricing is dicey at best. the last few sentances of the guidance says it best: “In all of these situations, as well as in others too numerous to mention,
    advertisers should make certain that the bargain offer is genuine and truthful. Doing so
    will serve their own interest as well as that of the public.”

  • technomage1

    Really? there’s more to the law than just the paragraph you’ve stated. OK then, I offer my spare room for $1M a night. I’ll wait a week, then drop the price to $100 a night. Now, I’ve offered the $1M a night in good faith. No one (I hope) would be insane enough to pay it so my room was unused. Does that mean I can advertise the room as “discounted” at whatever % $100 is of $1M? No, because comparable rooms like mine don’t go for nearly $1M a night in the area. Or any other, most likely.

    (If anyone does want to pay $1M to stay in my spare room, please contact me immediately. We can work something out).

    Though I’ve backed off the “flat illegal” of it (see comments further down) this type of comparison pricing is dicey at best. the last few sentances of the guidance says it best: “In all of these situations, as well as in others too numerous to mention,
    advertisers should make certain that the bargain offer is genuine and truthful. Doing so
    will serve their own interest as well as that of the public.”

  • KaraJones

    That’s ridiculous. A local business here (retail store) had a fire a while back and was closed for 7 months. They re-opened about 10 months ago but so many people started shopping elsewhere that the store simply never re-gained it’s customer base. That is, until they did a Groupon at 50% off a few months ago. One voucher per person – a $20 voucher for $40 worth of stuff – and you had to use the whole thing in one shot. It was a great deal for the customers and I spoke to the owner while I was using my voucher. He said that they did phenomenal business from it. And now they got not only their old customers back but they got a lot of new ones. In fact, they did so well that they are doing it again this week with a new voucher.

    What do you learn from this? The Groupon was a reasonably priced option for the store to get a lot of new business. And once people came in to the store, most of them will be repeat customers. The business is now thriving.

    So your post had absolutely no validity to it and was just bashing based on nothing.

  • KaraJones

    That’s ridiculous. A local business here (retail store) had a fire a while back and was closed for 7 months. They re-opened about 10 months ago but so many people started shopping elsewhere that the store simply never re-gained it’s customer base. That is, until they did a Groupon at 50% off a few months ago. One voucher per person – a $20 voucher for $40 worth of stuff – and you had to use the whole thing in one shot. It was a great deal for the customers and I spoke to the owner while I was using my voucher. He said that they did phenomenal business from it. And now they got not only their old customers back but they got a lot of new ones. In fact, they did so well that they are doing it again this week with a new voucher.

    What do you learn from this? The Groupon was a reasonably priced option for the store to get a lot of new business. And once people came in to the store, most of them will be repeat customers. The business is now thriving.

    So your post had absolutely no validity to it and was just bashing based on nothing.

  • KaraJones

    LOL! I’d buy a voucher to see that!

  • KaraJones

    LOL! I’d buy a voucher to see that!

  • Rebecca

    That wouldn’t be “honestly and in good faith.” That’s the difference; your example is purposely deceptive.

  • Rebecca

    That wouldn’t be “honestly and in good faith.” That’s the difference; your example is purposely deceptive.

  • y_p_w

    It’s always interesting when “premium” is the lowest level for a product or service. Yes – everyone is a VIP with us.

    Honestly – I’ve had some stellar wine tasting events before (of all things) a baseball game. They had different events over the years using anything from plastic cups to souvenir plastic wine glasses (this is a stadium where they do worry about people breaking glass to use as weapons). The best deal was $6 getting 6 tastings. All of the wineries were donating their product with the proceeds going to charity. Most of the wineries were really generous – from half to a full glass. OTOH – it had almost the potential to be like the infamous ten cent beer night in Cleveland.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_Cent_Beer_Night

  • y_p_w

    It’s always interesting when “premium” is the lowest level for a product or service. Yes – everyone is a VIP with us.

    Honestly – I’ve had some stellar wine tasting events before (of all things) a baseball game. They had different events over the years using anything from plastic cups to souvenir plastic wine glasses (this is a stadium where they do worry about people breaking glass to use as weapons). The best deal was $6 getting 6 tastings. All of the wineries were donating their product with the proceeds going to charity. Most of the wineries were really generous – from half to a full glass. OTOH – it had almost the potential to be like the infamous ten cent beer night in Cleveland.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_Cent_Beer_Night

  • technomage1

    My example is purposely exaggerated. But you can bet if some sucker offered me that amount to stay there, they could. That’s an honest and good faith offer. But if it makes you uncomfortable, let’s lower that price to $200 a night. Again, no one would (or should) take me up on this. But then, could I advertise my room for a half off special? Nope, because I jacked up the price just so I could lower it. Also a no-no.

    So what do you do when a hotel price goes up and down like a yo-yo in a matter of hours?

    Really, the ultimate question here is what “baseline” price could a hotel or groupon reasonably use to compare discounted rates since there really doesn’t seem to be a useful or apparent measure. The hotel industry appears to charge whatever the market will bear, kind of like an auction for rooms. I’ve suggested average price for the season but there may be other measures.

  • technomage1

    My example is purposely exaggerated. But you can bet if some sucker offered me that amount to stay there, they could. That’s an honest and good faith offer. But if it makes you uncomfortable, let’s lower that price to $200 a night. Again, no one would (or should) take me up on this. But then, could I advertise my room for a half off special? Nope, because I jacked up the price just so I could lower it. Also a no-no.

    So what do you do when a hotel price goes up and down like a yo-yo in a matter of hours?

    Really, the ultimate question here is what “baseline” price could a hotel or groupon reasonably use to compare discounted rates since there really doesn’t seem to be a useful or apparent measure. The hotel industry appears to charge whatever the market will bear, kind of like an auction for rooms. I’ve suggested average price for the season but there may be other measures.

  • imacboy

    That’s what I am saying. Groupon was great, they were POd that the hotel suddenly was enforcing a blackout date. But it just made me leary of using them in the future because what other deals will the company I got a groupon for suddenly change to terms? Less stress, no more groupon

  • imacboy

    That’s what I am saying. Groupon was great, they were POd that the hotel suddenly was enforcing a blackout date. But it just made me leary of using them in the future because what other deals will the company I got a groupon for suddenly change to terms? Less stress, no more groupon

  • EdB

    The former is what I expect too. While “legal”, not very ethical. Because they didn’t address that part, I do think they were just trying to “hype” up a standard feature.

  • EdB

    The former is what I expect too. While “legal”, not very ethical. Because they didn’t address that part, I do think they were just trying to “hype” up a standard feature.

  • http://www.facebook.com/philip.brown.12576 Philip Brown

    What ever happened to “the customer is ALWAYS right (except for complete idiots – of course). This customer was UPSET & he was not afforded the customer service that he – and every customer – deserves. I agree, some research would have avoided this; but some companies seem to have “thin skins” when it comes to MAKING THINGS RIGHT.
    Now, you have a disgrunted customer that will tell all his family & friends not to do business with G; this negates all the good deals & PR of the company. G, you had a chance to impress a customer & you FUMBLED THE BALL!

  • http://www.facebook.com/philip.brown.12576 Philip Brown

    What ever happened to “the customer is ALWAYS right (except for complete idiots – of course). This customer was UPSET & he was not afforded the customer service that he – and every customer – deserves. I agree, some research would have avoided this; but some companies seem to have “thin skins” when it comes to MAKING THINGS RIGHT.
    Now, you have a disgrunted customer that will tell all his family & friends not to do business with G; this negates all the good deals & PR of the company. G, you had a chance to impress a customer & you FUMBLED THE BALL!

  • TonyA_says

    Dear technomage1,

    Please do not use OTA websites to do your hotel rate research.

    What you need is access to the hotel’s Best Available Rate (BAR) information.
    Unless you have a GDS, that is not easy to do.

    Anyway, I hope to shed light in these discussions by posting this hotel’s BAR below:

    JUNE 2013
    BW05461 BEST WESTERN PLUS SONOMA INN
    IN FRI 07JUN/OUT SUN 09JUN NBR PERSONS: 2
    BW BKG CODE: A2QRACA
    RATE: 339.99 USD PER NIGHT STARTING 07JUN FOR 2 NIGHTS
    679.98 USD TOTAL RATE STARTING 07JUN FOR 2 NIGHTS
    ROOM RATE DETAIL:
    2 PERCNT MISC PER NT BEG 07JUN FOR 2 NTS
    0.06 PERCNT MISC PER NT BEG 07JUN FOR 2 NTS
    10 PERCNT OCCUP TX PER NT BEG 07JUN FOR 2 NTS
    762.02 USD TOTAL AMOUNT OF STAY
    DESCRIPTION: BEST AVAILABLE RATE*NO RESTRICTIONS
    2 QUEEN BEDS NSMK FIREPL BALCNY WIFI NET
    REFRIG COFMK CONTINENTAL BREAKFAST

    DECEMBER 2013
    BW05461 BEST WESTERN PLUS SONOMA INN
    IN FRI 27DEC/OUT SUN 29DEC NBR PERSONS: 2
    BW BKG CODE: A2QRACA
    RATE: 149.99 USD PER NIGHT STARTING 27DEC FOR 2 NIGHTS
    299.98 USD TOTAL RATE STARTING 27DEC FOR 2 NIGHTS
    ROOM RATE DETAIL:
    2 PERCNT MISC PER NT BEG 27DEC FOR 2 NTS
    0.06 PERCNT MISC PER NT BEG 27DEC FOR 2 NTS
    10 PERCNT OCCUP TX PER NT BEG 27DEC FOR 2 NTS
    336.18 USD TOTAL AMOUNT OF STAY
    DESCRIPTION: BEST AVAILABLE RATE*NO RESTRICTIONS
    2 QUEEN BEDS NSMK FIREPL BALCNY WIFI NET
    REFRIG COFMK CONTINENTAL BREAKFAST

    The OP clearly got a good deal for $320 (2 nights, 2 Queen beds w/ fireplace with VIP wine tasting).

  • TonyA_says

    Dear technomage1,

    Please do not use OTA websites to do your hotel rate research.

    What you need is access to the hotel’s Best Available Rate (BAR) information.
    Unless you have a GDS, that is not easy to do.

    Anyway, I hope to shed light in these discussions by posting this hotel’s BAR below:

    JUNE 2013
    BW05461 BEST WESTERN PLUS SONOMA INN
    IN FRI 07JUN/OUT SUN 09JUN NBR PERSONS: 2
    BW BKG CODE: A2QRACA
    RATE: 339.99 USD PER NIGHT STARTING 07JUN FOR 2 NIGHTS
    679.98 USD TOTAL RATE STARTING 07JUN FOR 2 NIGHTS
    ROOM RATE DETAIL:
    2 PERCNT MISC PER NT BEG 07JUN FOR 2 NTS
    0.06 PERCNT MISC PER NT BEG 07JUN FOR 2 NTS
    10 PERCNT OCCUP TX PER NT BEG 07JUN FOR 2 NTS
    762.02 USD TOTAL AMOUNT OF STAY
    DESCRIPTION: BEST AVAILABLE RATE*NO RESTRICTIONS
    2 QUEEN BEDS NSMK FIREPL BALCNY WIFI NET
    REFRIG COFMK CONTINENTAL BREAKFAST

    DECEMBER 2013
    BW05461 BEST WESTERN PLUS SONOMA INN
    IN FRI 27DEC/OUT SUN 29DEC NBR PERSONS: 2
    BW BKG CODE: A2QRACA
    RATE: 149.99 USD PER NIGHT STARTING 27DEC FOR 2 NIGHTS
    299.98 USD TOTAL RATE STARTING 27DEC FOR 2 NIGHTS
    ROOM RATE DETAIL:
    2 PERCNT MISC PER NT BEG 27DEC FOR 2 NTS
    0.06 PERCNT MISC PER NT BEG 27DEC FOR 2 NTS
    10 PERCNT OCCUP TX PER NT BEG 27DEC FOR 2 NTS
    336.18 USD TOTAL AMOUNT OF STAY
    DESCRIPTION: BEST AVAILABLE RATE*NO RESTRICTIONS
    2 QUEEN BEDS NSMK FIREPL BALCNY WIFI NET
    REFRIG COFMK CONTINENTAL BREAKFAST

    The OP clearly got a good deal for $320 (2 nights, 2 Queen beds w/ fireplace with VIP wine tasting).

  • Pingback: Frugal Monkey's Web Wrap - 15 March 2013 - FrugalMonkey Travel Discounts | FrugalMonkey Travel Discounts

  • Frugal Monkey

    This is is such a great article. Sadly my parents have found themselves stung in much the same way. Just wanted to let you know I’ve included this article in our bi-weekly Web Wrap: http://www.frugalmonkey.com/travel-news/web-wrap-15-march-2013.html

  • Frugal Monkey

    This is is such a great article. Sadly my parents have found themselves stung in much the same way. Just wanted to let you know I’ve included this article in our bi-weekly Web Wrap: http://www.frugalmonkey.com/travel-news/web-wrap-15-march-2013.html