What is RCCL hiding?

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Neil Maley

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What do you call it, if the cruise line knows it is not going to get to the ports it is advertising but takes your reservationsand money based on the published itinerary? When RCCL answers my questions and shows me the exact dates that this ships' problems came about, I will either apologize or feel vindicated
You go to the cruise contract and read their disclaimers about how they have the right to change the ports.
 
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Another thing to consider is you could be on a ship that has St. Thomas as the itinerary and if a storm is happening while you are sailing, they could change to another island at the last minute.

Algebralover is 100% correct- if St. Thomas is the only reason you are taking a cruise- do a land trip instead because anything can happen at the last minute.
3 couples are going on a cruise since a cruise offers many options and each couple can do what they enjoy. The thing we most agreed on was we all wanted to have St. Thomas be one of the ports.
 
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You agreed to the contract when you signed up to go on a cruise. This is what the contract says:

6. CANCELLATION, DEVIATION OR SUBSTITUTION BY CARRIER:
a. Carrier may for any reason at any time and without prior notice, cancel, advance, postpone or deviate from any
scheduled sailing, port of call, destination, lodging or any activity on or off the Vessel, or substitute another vessel or
port of call, destination, lodging or activity.
All cruise lines have this in their contracts. Modern leisure cruising is not a ferry service, they have no obligation to transport you to any specific location. If you don't agree then cruising is not for you. If your goal is to reach a specific destination, you need to book a service with that specific purpose.
 
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You agreed to the contract when you signed up to go on a cruise. This is what the contract says:



All cruise lines have this in their contracts. Modern leisure cruising is not a ferry service, they have no obligation to transport you to any specific location. If you don't agree then cruising is not for you. If your goal is to reach a specific destination, you need to book a service with that specific purpose.
Thank you for the information. I fully understand this part of the cruise contract. At this point I reiterate my main problem:
Why will RCCL not tell me how the ship is going to be able to get to St. Thomas in November and not in October when it does not go into drydock for repairs until April or may of 2020.
That is what I am looking for at this point
 

weihlac

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Jun 30, 2017
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What do you call it, if the cruise line knows it is not going to get to the ports it is advertising but takes your reservationsand money based on the published itinerary? When RCCL answers my questions and shows me the exact dates that this ships' problems came about, I will either apologize or feel vindicated
You should not expect RCCL to respond to your questions as asked. You may be able to get this information from other sources like Cruise Critic, but this information is RCCL proprietary information that they do not wish to divulge to you or to their competitors.

Your contract of carriage allows them to change ports entirely at their discretion for any reason. This is true for all cruises and all cruise operators.

You can appeal to RCCL and seek a full refund and book elsewhere.
https://www.elliott.org/company-contacts/royal-caribbean/
 
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Why will RCCL not tell me how the ship is going to be able to get to St. Thomas in November and not in October when it does not go into drydock for repairs until April or may of 2020.
Simple. Because they don't owe you that. They are under no obligation to divulge their internal operations planning to you. If I ran a cruise line, I wouldn't share that kind of information with consumers either because I don't want it getting posted on the internet and falling into the hands of my competitors.

If I had to guess, I'd say all sailings between now and drydock will follow the altered schedule. I'm confident those November sailings will be eventually altered too.
 

johnbaker

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@ThommyB They aren't going to do that. Fact is according to the contract you agreed to, they don't have to. For all you know, the is a long lead time part that doesn't need a drydock to replace. You're just assuming that they need a drydock to replace it.

You've become aggressive through the BBB etc. At this point, all RCCL is going to do is what they're legally required to do by contract.
If you want to push this further, you'll need to get a lawyer but good luck finding one near you experienced in maritime law that will take this case.
 

weihlac

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@ThommyB They aren't going to do that. Fact is according to the contract you agreed to, they don't have to. For all you know, the is a long lead time part that doesn't need a drydock to replace. You're just assuming that they need a drydock to replace it.

You've become aggressive through the BBB etc. At this point, all RCCL is going to do is what they're legally required to do by contract.
If you want to push this further, you'll need to get a lawyer but good luck finding one near you experienced in maritime law that will take this case.
May well need a Liberian lawyer in Liberia.
 

Neil Maley

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Thank you for the information. I fully understand this part of the cruise contract. At this point I reiterate my main problem:
Why will RCCL not tell me how the ship is going to be able to get to St. Thomas in November and not in October when it does not go into drydock for repairs until April or may of 2020.
That is what I am looking for at this point
Use our company contacts and start writing to the Executives. We can’t do anything else for you except to advise you to do that.

You are wasting time by not going to RCCL using our contacts. Please read this on how to escalate and let us know what they say.

https://forum.elliott.org/threads/resolving-consumer-complaints-and-developing-a-paper-trail.8903/
 

Neil Maley

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I have an email from RCCL stating the problem wouldn't be fixed until the Allure went into drydock in April or May of 2020
That is from Customer Service. It is not from corporate. Please use the information we gave you and start writing to corporate. It is not going to change the outcome but you have a legitimate question on why the November cruises still show St. Thomas. Right now, that is your question correct?
 
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That is from Customer Service. It is not from corporate. Please use the information we gave you and start writing to corporate. It is not going to change the outcome but you have a legitimate question on why the November cruises still show St. Thomas. Right now, that is your question correct?
That is my question and I have sent an email to corporate based on your contact information
 
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Needless to say we weren't happy with the change and after talking or Emailing numerous people at RCCL, including Christon Butler, our original contact and Kally Meghoo from the Executive Office”...

“They say it takes a long time to change ports and they work in batches of several months at a time. Well then if they work that far in advance, wouldn't they know when I booked in April, the ship wasn't going to make it to St. Thomas, since they let me know only a couple of weeks later?”


It seems that the OP has already written to RCL and also complained to the BBB — I am not sure if someone else from executive office will say anything different.

First of all I am not a cruise person and am uncomfortable with a lot of the industry. Never taken a cruise and probably never will.

But there comes a point where realism has to step in. I doubt any cruise line is going to tell you when the mechanical issues were noted.

From limited research — problem with propulsion means lower speeds so not to strain the azipods.

St. Thomas is a narrow and at parts shallow port that is one of the most challenging in the area.

Getting a cruise ship into a port is not like parking a car. There are so many things to take into consideration such a currents and other port traffic.

The OP was told November schedules have not been addressed yet — that may be the case may not. It makes sense in terms of seasons — currents and hurricanes and such and waiting for ports to answer.

They may be making adjustments as to speed allowed so not to strain the system and taking into account the requirements to enter the narrow port of St Thomas.

But at this point I think doubling down on the questions and demanding answers as to when something was known and why .... those questions may remain unanswered and previous responses may be repeated so one should be prepared to receive in essence the same response.
 

justlisa

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With regard to why November and later haven't been adjusted yet - Royal had ships going to Cuba and they had to do all the itinerary changes for those ship. Which undoubtedly took a lot of time of their logistic team and likely pushed back other less critical reroutings.

Or as I said they might be entertaining other solutions before the Atlantic crossing. Like I mentioned earlier Carnival is using a new drydock option to fix the azipods on the Vista. Maybe Royal is looking at that? Though Vista is quite a bit smaller so maybe not.
 

Mel65

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I have an email from RCCL stating the problem wouldn't be fixed until the Allure went into drydock in April or May of 2020
Then it sounds like they've communicate to you all they are willing to tell you. You have wrapped yourself around the axle about information that you may never get. Sometimes you have take a deep breath, shrug your shoulders and accept that this is how it is. You do NOT KNOW that the November cruise is actually going to GO TO St. Thomas. Right now it is ONLY advertised to go there. So was your cruise at one point in time, right? Getting so angry and spun up is only causing YOU stress. The cruise line does not care. Convene with your traveling partners and decide what to do and then ENJOY yourselves.
 
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Then it sounds like they've communicate to you all they are willing to tell you. You have wrapped yourself around the axle about information that you may never get. Sometimes you have take a deep breath, shrug your shoulders and accept that this is how it is. You do NOT KNOW that the November cruise is actually going to GO TO St. Thomas. Right now it is ONLY advertised to go there. So was your cruise at one point in time, right? Getting so angry and spun up is only causing YOU stress. The cruise line does not care. Convene with your traveling partners and decide what to do and then ENJOY yourselves.
I understand what you are all saying, but it doesn't seem right that RCCL can advertise something they know they will not deliver, if that is the case
 
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I understand what you are all saying, but it doesn't seem right that RCCL can advertise something they know they will not deliver, if that is the case
Except you don't know that they won't deliver on it...there may be other itinerary changes that they make to those November sailings that DO permit them to make St. Thomas. Or a temporary fix that solves the mechanical issue is discovered that WILL mean they make St. Thomas.
 
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I understand what you are all saying, but it doesn't seem right that RCCL can advertise something they know they will not deliver, if that is the case
But they may not know that yet. Cruise companies have had to deal with the rescheduled Cuba cruises and ports are likely taking their time to reschedule and answer. They may not have gotten around to November yet — and that is what you have been told.

What if they give a nonsense answer — such as we are waiting for updated tide and currents charts and for the port to accept the slow moving ship for the November schedule...

Then what? How does that help you? There are many possible vague reasons which could be credible ..

You are understandably upset with the schedule change— but now seem intent on proving that there is something illegal going on— and for what — leverage for a refund? Maybe you will get lucky with the execs and maybe not — especially as they have closed the file on your complaint and the BBB complaint.

I doubt you will have a “gotcha” moment which seems to be the goal — most corporate communications are too careful for that — which is why they are vague.
 

Neil Maley

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Have you tried moving to the No ember
That is my question and I have sent an email to corporate based on your contact information
Which executive have you written to? You need to give them a week to reply so if there are 4 execs, it’s a one month process.

There is nothing else we can do here. Please let us know what each executive says.

It’s too bad you opted for the non refundable deposit- this wouldn’t be an issue if you had booked the refundable. That’s actually the crux of the problem.