Is this a scam? Travel To Go leaves one couple disappointed

Should I renew my membership - or not? / Photo by tasuki - Flickr
We’ve talked about vacation club scams in the past — and I’m on record as saying I’ve never run across a legitimate travel club — but what happens to the folks who plunk down thousands of dollars for a membership?

Well, meet Cheryl and Don Harvey, who were vacationing in Branson, Mo., with friends last March when they were approached by a salesman for a company called Travel To Go.

“We were asked if we wanted a way to travel cheaper,” says Cheryl Harvey. “In return for listening to this information, we would be given dinner out and maybe some theater tickets. We agreed to go the next morning.”

Theater is exactly what they got. In the sales meeting, the couple heard a brief but compelling sales pitch. I’ll hand the mike to Harvey to explain.

You buy a membership for over $3,000, which will entitle you hotels and weekly vacations at a very discounted rate.

After some deliberation the sales person also offered a free cruise, and discounted airfare package if we were to purchase the vacation membership.

We were also told we could add our grown children’s names and any family members or friends to this list so they could benefit as well, with cheaper travel.

They insisted we pay for the full package that day with offering to take a credit card. We purchased the program.

So the Harveys paid $3,000 for their club membership. And here’s what happened next.

Upon trying to use their “hot weeks” — the so-called “discounted” travel weeks — we realized that you can go on the Internet and get the same deals without any costly membership.

The so-called ‘free’ cruise ended up costing us extra money to hold it and extra money for port fees. Also, it was a inside cabin in a not very desirable part of the ship. We were told that we probably would not get to travel with our friends.

The cruise came with many restrictions, including giving 90 days notice as to when we could go and dates that are blacked out. We are finally scheduled to take the cruise in a month, during hurricane season. The airfare voucher didn’t save us any money.

In other words, the Harveys are disappointed — very disappointed — at their $3,000 membership.

Now, Travel To Go wants Harvey to renew his membership for $200, which is just a fraction of the $3,000 he and his wife paid.

“Is there any recourse for scams like this?” she asked me. “We understand they are still selling these vacation packages in Branson and probably other cities.”

I don’t think renewing your membership is a good idea, I told her. Given their disappointing experience and all the strings that came attached to their offer, I think another year would yield similar results. Plus, Harvey believes Travel To Go is a “scam” — and who wants to do business with someone they believe is a scammer?

Travel To Go, for its part, sees itself as not only offering a legitimate product, but also being an outstanding corporate citizen. It claims to have an A+ rating with the BBB and to be active with charities, such as a fundraiser for breast cancer survivors. However, it is vague about its product, and it is not difficult to find other customers with complaints that are similar to Harvey’s. (You’ll pardon me if I don’t link to its site from this post.)

Emails sent to Travel To Go asking for comment on Harvey’s case were not returned.

But is Travel To GoTravel To Go To Go a scam? It did offer the Harveys something for their money. Worth $3,000? Probably not. Sold under suspicious circumstances? Probably. But that doesn’t necessarily make it a scam.

Or does it?

I have a stricter definition of “scam.” If Travel To Go had taken their $3,000 and given them nothing for it, then that would be scammier. But in some respects, that’s exactly what the Harveys are saying — that they could have saved the $3,000 and gotten the exact same thing.

So which is it?

  • sirwired

    For the price of something to be fair, the value of having the thing must be roughly equal to the price paid to acquire it.  (Note that this is different from the cost to create it; the difference between the cost to create and the price to acquire is called Gross Profit.)  Both parties getting a fair deal is the very bedrock of well-functioning capitalism.

    The value of this thing (the club membership) is far below the price charged for it.  The price charged was unfair by a huge amount, probably an order of magnitude.

    Is this legal?  Probably.  But that doesn’t mean it’s not a scam.

  • http://flyicarusfly.com/ Fly, Icarus, Fly

    I’m not sure it’s a scam as much as a horrible buy. The company probably likens itself to a travel agency where members can do one stop shopping. How much is that worth?

    And the OP only thought to comparison shop AFTER plunking down the money? The foundation of a free market economy is that prices for most things are subjective. Someone can charge $5 for a painting and someone else 5 million. If there weren’t any yahoos who fell for this, these would quickly go out of business. (And they’re even CONSIDERING re-upping for $200? If they do, after all they’ve been through, there is no hope for them…)

    That being said, I think these would be imminently difficult to regulate, though. How would you define the value of a service?

    Pretty please vote for me, people!

  • http://www.balivillaholidays.com/ Bali Villa Holidays

    Though some might consider it just a marketing cheat but yeah considering that amount they juice from people it should be considered a scam already.

  • finance_tony

    No it isn’t.  Your vote has nothing to do with voting against travel scams.  It has to do with voting for a spammer. 

  • Elmo Clarity

    “I have a stricter definition of “scam.” If Travel To Go had taken their $3,000 and given them nothing for it, then that would be scammier”

    I would say they fit your description then.  They paid $3000 but didn’t get anything they couldn’t have gotten on their own as they stated.  So basically, you are paying them $3000 to make reservations for you on an internet travel site it sounds like.

  • http://elliott.org Christopher Elliott

    Oh, that’s funny. Fly, you are shameless! :-)

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_OEPJGQPIEB75YYDE5CJY6R3VFE Carver Clark Farrow II

    I would say unequivocally that its a scam.  In my boat, a scam is when the item sold is materially misrepresented.  Hallmarks of a scam are high pressure tactics used to prevent the purchaser from critically thinking about the purchase or comparison shopping.

    The implication here is that by purchasing the package, the OPs would be able to have access to exclusive discounts unavailable to them without the club purchase.  This apparently was not true. According to the OP, these deals were easily accessible through the internet without the need of a vacation purchase.  That’s why the high pressure tactics to get the OPs to purchase immediately.

    It is made further into a scam because of the onerous restrictions placed on the usage of the package that a reasonable person would not anticipate.

    This is not about valuation nor fair pricing.   Those a red herrings.  Its about getting what you were lead to believe you were buying and being able to use it in the normal manner.  Valuation is legitimately subjective. The difference between a bad deal and a scam is that in a bad deal you still get exactly what you expected. 

    For example, if you rent a vacation rental and the pictures were photoshopped, outdated, or simply didn’t accurately reflect the condition or the property, that might be a scam depending on the intent of the owner.

    However, if everything is as represented but its just expensive or overpriced, C’est la vie.

  • http://elliott.org Christopher Elliott

    You’re right, they probably do. Just giving them the benefit of the doubt. And I want to know what everyone else thinks.

    All of these operators can, at some point, show us a list of happy customers. That may be an interesting post, at some point. Do happy customers mean it isn’t a scam?

  • Raven_Altosk

    Never trust a salesman who approaches you on vacation. Period.

    I’ll call this one a scam because it’s not delivering what was promised and it’s one of those high pressure sales deals. If you have to be trapped in a room to be sold something, it’s a scam.

  • MarkieA

    This is a question for the lawyers in th group. Isn’t there, by law, a built-in grace period – a Buyer’s Remorse clause, if you will – for all contracts of this type? I thought it was around 3 days.

  • http://twitter.com/johntbaker John Baker

    I’d say this is a horrible,stupid purchase but not a scam. They did receive a cruise and they were able to purchase travel through the club. Now the cruise was limited to when no one else wanted to travel and in a cabin the cruiseline had to give away to sell. The travel wasn’t much if any savings over what they could have found on their own but they did receive some benefit.

    The “club” doesn’t return phone calls and you receive no benefit… Scam. A club that gives you the same benefit you could purchase on the internet if you looked hard… stupid buy.

    There are other places in the travel world where you pay a third party to find you deals and book travel. The only difference here is the size of the fee.

    I’m with a lot of other people on this board though. If I can’t think about the purchase before I make it, I’m not making it. Sorry. If it has to be done before I leave the room, its not getting done.

  • Jeanne_in_NE

    Not spam, but a request for community support.  Go back and read the comments section from yesterday’s article (one of the oldest comments).  It’s a vote for a picture F,I,F took and entered into a contest. 

  • Jeanne_in_NE

    “Happy” doesn’t necessarily mean informed nor savvy.

  • Jeanne_in_NE

    Darn, how do some people get all the super powers?  Raven-sense and Snarkiness both!

  • backprop

    I will say, today’s wording makes it sound like something other than what it is.

    I’m not a big fan of panhandling for votes on the message boards, but usually don’t say anything because it’s so ubiquitous. 

    But this message, while perhaps trying to be tongue-in-cheek, is misleading and inappopriate.

  • BillCCC

    I am not sure if it a scam or more likely taking advantage of someone. Insisting that they pay immediately is usually a clue that what you will receive is not worth the price. 

  • mbods

    Sure sounds like a scam to me and honestly, in this day and age, folks ought to know better, don’t you think?

  • sirwired

     Someone can indeed think a $5M painting is worthless because art is indeed subjective.

    But in this case, we CAN place a rough dollar value on a fair price, and that price is nearly $0.  The identical service is available for low, or no, cost from any number of online, phone, or in-person travel agencies.  The only part of the package that was worth anything was the cruise, and it sounds like that would only have been a few hundred bucks, tops, for the fare.  (I’m guessing it was a 3 or 4-nt Carnival, which routinely sell for no more than $2-300/pp for lousy cabins in the off-season; less if it’s a bulk group purchase.)

    But you are correct that people making stupid buying decisions is tough to regulate.  Not all scams are illegal. 

    Your cancellation period idea is a good one; there are specific rules allowing the prompt 100% cancellation of in-home purchases and gym memberships.  I see no reason why this could not be extended to travel clubs.  (It’d be nice if that also extended to time-shares, given the way they are usually sold, but alas that is deeded real estate and purchases cannot be undone with the wave of a regulatory hand.)

  • Nikki

    I look at it like this:  if certain regulars on this beat say it’s a scam, I’m liable to believe it.  Raven will argue with a stop sign, Tony_A will beat you over the head with experience, and Carver will have us wondering if the OP’s suffering from a case of “the wheel’s spinning, but the hamster’s dead.”.  So, with that consensus, there goes. 

    The OP needs to just chalk that 3K off to experience and leave those people alone.  Post complaints in the appropriate forums so people can see what they’ve had to experience, and hope for the best. 

    Unfortunately, as long as there are people willing to buy, there’s a tool with a hard-sell scam.  I’d say mediate it, but to what end?  It’s the same old story – the scammers pack up and get out of town, and they open up shop somewhere else under another fancy new name.

  • http://flyicarusfly.com/ Fly, Icarus, Fly

    I DO try! I thought I was being funny yet inconspicuous, but I guess not everyone thought so. Sorry if I offended! Jeanne, thanks for having my back!

  • http://flyicarusfly.com/ Fly, Icarus, Fly

    I do think it’s preying on the gullible, but I think it boils down to exactly what was promised. Wording like “exclusive deals” or “significant discounts” are hard to pin down because they very well may provide that. For someone not willing to do an internet search or follow TravelZoo type sites, it may be worth it to pay someone else to do it. But 3K? Definitely not.

  • emanon256

    I could not agree more.  Any time someone says, “This offer is good right now only” It’s a scam.  I have kicked many a sales man out of my house for saying that.  These were ones I invited in.  Like bathroom out fitters that advertise in the mall and offer a free $50 gas card.  They always give the same pitch. “I am the manager, so you got lucky you have me, I just have my employees pushing around brooms right now, so I’ll drop the $5,000 price I just showed you to $3,000 if you promise not to tell anyone and put a sign in your yard.”  Then they say it’s only good right now, and they won’t put anything in writing.  So $3,000 to put an insert over a crummy bath tub?  Guess what it cost when we hired a general contractor to rip out and replace the tub and re-tile the shower, it was closer to $1,700 parts and labor.

  • http://flyicarusfly.com/ Fly, Icarus, Fly

    I think he was bitten by a mean, radioactive bird… haha

    This topic is an interesting one, though. Say you walked away from a totally legit used car sale only to later find out you paid way over the blue book value. Did you get scammed? Or was it a matter of not knowing the value of what you were buying? (Which in this case was very little?) Is it only a scam when you overpay by a whole lot?

    I have a feeling these types of companies exist because they can prove they’re delivering what they say they are. Someone needs to go on a presentation and record the pitch and / or pdf their promotional material so we can all see. Any takers?

  • http://flyicarusfly.com/ Fly, Icarus, Fly

    Sad but true, methinks.

  • Bill Armstrong

    Scam or not, it is definitely not a wise buying decision.

  • Bill Armstrong

    Scam or not, it is definitely not a wise buying decision.

  • http://www.facebook.com/asiansm Dang Ph

    The best thing is NOT to renew the membership and forget the whole affair for good. Turn the page, enjoy your life, don’t look back. 

  • HomeyDont

    A scam is when you are promised something that was not delivered.  They were given everything they were promised – the cruise, vouchers, and entry into their plan.  What they probably didn’t realize was that the discounts were off the retail prices of the properties.  Now the fact that you can do your own research and find similar prices is really irrelevant. 

    This is not a scam, but simply a stupid, uninformed purchase.  And really, how many people in 2012 do NOT know that these are high pressure sales pitches???  Do they live under a rock?

  • emanon256

    Cool, it says I can vote once per day!  You got my vote again :)

  • HomeyDont

     Some states allow three days to rescind purchases when the sales people come to you.  Like door to door.  You go to them it shows you are a willing participant.

  • HomeyDont

     So if I’m unhappy with a purchase it’s a scam?  Sounds like a line an ambulance chaser would use to drum up biz.

  • HomeyDont

     All due respect you don’t know how it was represented.  In most situations people hear what they want to hear, read what they want to read.  Look at all of the people starting a class action suit against Facebook.  Their premise is that the stock dropped because of facts not represented or misrepresented.  Over and over again you can read analysts saying it was all out there.  In fact, some of the headlines days before the IPO screamed about falling earnings projections.

    When you listen to them more carefully, they say “How can a company with 900 million users not be worth more?”  And then you realize they only read whet they wanted to read into it.

    Same situation here.  They got their air vouchers.  They are getting their discounted rates.  The fact that I can get similar rates for free on my own time is really irrelevant.  They got what the company promised.  They just didn’t listen and engage their brains.

  • HomeyDont

     Why do people continue to think they can get something for free in life?  I am simply amazed at the genius of PT Barnum every day…

  • emanon256

    Car salesman hate me.  I show up knowing what car to buy, what my trade in is worth, and I already have the NADA values, KBB Values, and Edmunds values.  When you say to them KBB says its work $X, they always reply, well we use NADA.  When you go in saying NADA says…They say they use KBB.  When we bought my wife’s car, the dear even showed us a print out from KBB saying the value and what deal we were getting and I made him re-run it on the KBB website in front of me, the value was quite different from the print out he initially showed.  And even when they drop the value to a closer to fair price, I always walk away.  If a manager doesn’t follow me to the parking lot with a better offer or they don’t call me back with a better offer that same day, it wasn’t meant to be. 
     
    I bought a used car two years ago and traded it in this last August for $2,000 more than I bought it for.  I usually keep car longer than that, but needed a more family friendly car. 
     
    I must disclose, I got a job as a car salesman back in 2001.  Though I got fired 6 week into the job for refusing to lie to a customer, I kid you not.  It’s a shady business, but I learned a lot of their tricks.  I don’t know how the sleep at night.

  • HomeyDont

    If everyone is commenting this is a bad purchase and not a scam then why the vote tally???

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Shannon-Duane/727596077 Shannon Duane

    Here is the jury instruction (i.e. the required elements) for Intentional Misrepresentation for California (I just happened to be working on something that needed this, and since I work in California, this is the law I will use.  I’m sure other ones are similar):

    [Name of plaintiff] claims that [name of defendant] made a false
    representation that harmed [him/her/it]. To establish this claim,
    [name of plaintiff] must prove all of the following:

    1. That [name of defendant] represented to [name of plaintiff]
    that an important fact was true; 

    YES, the travel club represented that the buyers would be entitled to very discounted rates if they purchased a membership and booked through the travel club.  I’m going to assume for the moment that the buyers were told that they
    could ONLY get these deals through the travel club, or through another
    travel club.  I’ve been to travel club sales pitches (for free stuff… like the cruise they got… I’m good at saying NO) and they ALWAYS say stuff like “You can only get these discounts through us!”  So we’ll assume for the purposes of my hypothetical here that this travel club made that representation.  Want more proof?  If they didn’t say this, no one would ever get suckered into these things.

    2. That [name of defendant]’s representation was false;

    The buyers could get the same deals without having joined the travel club.  So, the representation that they would be entitled to discounts by JOINING the travel club is false.  Note I said “by JOINING.”  The representation is not that the club can get you discounts.  That, by itself, may be true.  The representation here is that you MUST JOIN the club to GET the discounts.  So, yes, the representation is false.  You can get the discounts without spending your money to join the club.

    3. That [name of defendant] knew that the representation was
    false when [he/she] made it, or that [he/she] made the
    representation recklessly and without regard for its truth;

    Can we all at least agree on this one?  The travel club definitely knew that the buyer could get the discounts elsewhere.  Unless the club can come up with some OTHER discounts that were available, I would be pretty confident in proving this one to a jury.

    4. That [name of defendant] intended that [name of plaintiff]
    rely on the representation;

    Again, can we all agree?  OF COURSE the club intended that the buyer rely upon the representation that the buyer would have to joint the club to get discounts on travel.  That was the point of the entire presentation.

    5. That [name of plaintiff] reasonably relied on [name of
    defendant]’s representation;

    They probably showed them a bunch of slide show pictures with all the “discounts.”  Would EVERYONE fall for this crap?  No.  But would a “reasonable” person?  You can argue NO, but I guarantee the answer is yes.  The “reasonable person” in law is pretty stupid most of the time.

    6. That [name of plaintiff] was harmed; and

    Obviously.  They spent 3k for nothing.

    7. That [name of plaintiff]’s reliance on [name of defendant]’s
    representation was a substantial factor in causing [his/her/
    its] harm.

    Again, this is pretty obvious.

    So tell me.  How is this NOT a scam?  That cruise they got… I’ve been on one of those voucher cruises.  This is the reason that I don’t think the cruise is relevant to this discussion. That was a VOUCHER.  It was purchased BY the travel club for the sole purpose of giving out “discounted” cruises.  It was NOT a benefit they were getting by joining.  Yes, they got it “because” they joined, but I would liken this more to a thanks for joinng present.  The travel club knew full well that the cruise was NOT work 3k by itself, so even if you want to throw in the “they got what they were promised” line, they STILL didn’t get what they were promised. 

    What they were promised was discounted travel rate for their $3,000.  That is NOT what they got.  What their 3k purchased was a likely a $200 per person 3 or 4 night cruise that they stil ended up paying $75 to $100 per person on to cover the port taxes.   

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Shannon-Duane/727596077 Shannon Duane

    Here is the jury instruction (i.e. the required elements) for Intentional Misrepresentation for California (I just happened to be working on something that needed this, and since I work in California, this is the law I will use.  I’m sure other ones are similar):

    [Name of plaintiff] claims that [name of defendant] made a false
    representation that harmed [him/her/it]. To establish this claim,
    [name of plaintiff] must prove all of the following:

    1. That [name of defendant] represented to [name of plaintiff]
    that an important fact was true; 

    YES, the travel club represented that the buyers would be entitled to very discounted rates if they purchased a membership and booked through the travel club.  I’m going to assume for the moment that the buyers were told that they
    could ONLY get these deals through the travel club, or through another
    travel club.  I’ve been to travel club sales pitches (for free stuff… like the cruise they got… I’m good at saying NO) and they ALWAYS say stuff like “You can only get these discounts through us!”  So we’ll assume for the purposes of my hypothetical here that this travel club made that representation.  Want more proof?  If they didn’t say this, no one would ever get suckered into these things.

    2. That [name of defendant]’s representation was false;

    The buyers could get the same deals without having joined the travel club.  So, the representation that they would be entitled to discounts by JOINING the travel club is false.  Note I said “by JOINING.”  The representation is not that the club can get you discounts.  That, by itself, may be true.  The representation here is that you MUST JOIN the club to GET the discounts.  So, yes, the representation is false.  You can get the discounts without spending your money to join the club.

    3. That [name of defendant] knew that the representation was
    false when [he/she] made it, or that [he/she] made the
    representation recklessly and without regard for its truth;

    Can we all at least agree on this one?  The travel club definitely knew that the buyer could get the discounts elsewhere.  Unless the club can come up with some OTHER discounts that were available, I would be pretty confident in proving this one to a jury.

    4. That [name of defendant] intended that [name of plaintiff]
    rely on the representation;

    Again, can we all agree?  OF COURSE the club intended that the buyer rely upon the representation that the buyer would have to joint the club to get discounts on travel.  That was the point of the entire presentation.

    5. That [name of plaintiff] reasonably relied on [name of
    defendant]’s representation;

    They probably showed them a bunch of slide show pictures with all the “discounts.”  Would EVERYONE fall for this crap?  No.  But would a “reasonable” person?  You can argue NO, but I guarantee the answer is yes.  The “reasonable person” in law is pretty stupid most of the time.

    6. That [name of plaintiff] was harmed; and

    Obviously.  They spent 3k for nothing.

    7. That [name of plaintiff]’s reliance on [name of defendant]’s
    representation was a substantial factor in causing [his/her/
    its] harm.

    Again, this is pretty obvious.

    So tell me.  How is this NOT a scam?  That cruise they got… I’ve been on one of those voucher cruises.  This is the reason that I don’t think the cruise is relevant to this discussion. That was a VOUCHER.  It was purchased BY the travel club for the sole purpose of giving out “discounted” cruises.  It was NOT a benefit they were getting by joining.  Yes, they got it “because” they joined, but I would liken this more to a thanks for joinng present.  The travel club knew full well that the cruise was NOT work 3k by itself, so even if you want to throw in the “they got what they were promised” line, they STILL didn’t get what they were promised. 

    What they were promised was discounted travel rate for their $3,000.  That is NOT what they got.  What their 3k purchased was a likely a $200 per person 3 or 4 night cruise that they stil ended up paying $75 to $100 per person on to cover the port taxes.   

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Shannon-Duane/727596077 Shannon Duane

     Usually only for purchasing real property.  This club isn’t giving them any interest in real property.  It’s just supposedly giving them access to discounts. 

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Shannon-Duane/727596077 Shannon Duane

     Usually only for purchasing real property.  This club isn’t giving them any interest in real property.  It’s just supposedly giving them access to discounts. 

  • AAmerican1

    There are recission periods, especially with time-shares, governed by the state laws where the property is either purchased or located. The recission period can be as little as 5 days up to a maximum of fifteen again depending on state law. People who purchase “pie-in-the-sky products based on the offer of of a free meal or theatre tickets get exactly what they deserve.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Shannon-Duane/727596077 Shannon Duane

    The real issue isn’t that the club could give discounts.  The issue with this scam (yes it’s a scam in my opinion) is that this club is basically representing that you CANNOT get these deals on your own.  I can almost guarantee they said something like this at the pitch. 

    Is this illegal?  Ehhh… most things aren’t illegal as in “criminal activity.”  Is is civil fraud? Yes, I think so.

  • naoma

    Never, ever get involved in these sort of things.  This includes “time share presentations.”  JUST SAY “NO.”

  • http://flyicarusfly.com/ Fly, Icarus, Fly

    Emanon, you sound like a nightmare customer!

    How do car salesmen sleep at night? Why, with travel club saleswomen, of course! haha

  • AAmerican1

    The reality is who goes on vacation with the intent of making a major purchase? Do you go to Vegas and all of a sudden decide to buy a new car? Where ever you vacation it’s a “tourist trap” to the extent there will be people there who want a percentage of your money. If you make a major purchase while on vacation where you have to decide to purchase on the spot then you have been scammed by your failure to act in a rational manner. Being on vacation is not an excuse to make stupid decisions. I have no empathy for people who travel and leave their brain and common sense at home and then whine about the stupid decisions they made.

    These people are taken advantage of because they allow themselves to be based on the enticement of “free”. There is NO free lunch. These people do not need an advocate they need a babysitter. 

  • 46Shasta19

    People need to think about what they are doing.  Why would anyone spend 3,000 on something that they never have time to check out?

  • http://twitter.com/johntbaker John Baker

    This wasn’t sold in CA so CA law isn’t relevant. In fact, I rarely here any of these “deals” being offered in CA because the law doesn’t favor them so a CA jury instruction doesn’t apply.

    Missouri would be interesting…

  • NotThatBrooklynGuy

    There are two kinds of people who have bought into vacation clubs:
    1)The ones that complain it is a scam.
    2)The ones who are too embarrassed to admit they fell for the scam.

  • ExplorationTravMag

    I voted yes on this one but, truthfully, I don’t know the OP doesn’t bear some of the responsibility.  Some fast research would have taught them this.  Also, caving to the pitch that they MUST do it right there…  That’s usually the first sign something’s amiss.

    Like you said, they DO offer a service but then so do cab drivers who “get lost” or take the scenic route when you use them.  

  • ExplorationTravMag

    I voted for you, Fly.  Good response here and good for you doing everything you can to win!

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Shannon-Duane/727596077 Shannon Duane

    I just said, I’m using California law because it’s what I had available.  I didn’t feel like looking up Missouri law at the time.  I ALSO said that the law was probably similar elsewhere.  Since you wanted to know:

    Fraud in Missouri is broadly bifurcated into two categories: intentional
    misrepresentation and negligent misrepresentation. Intentional
    misrepresentation consists of: (1) a representation; (2) its falsity;
    (3) its materiality; (4) the speaker’s knowledge of its falsity or
    his/her ignorance of the truth; (5) the speaker’s intent that his/her
    representation should be acted on by the hearer in the manner reasonable
    contemplated; (6) the hearer’s ignorance of the falsity of the
    representation; (7) the hearer’s reliance on the representation being
    true; (8) the hearer’s right to rely thereon; and (9) the hearer’s
    proximately caused injury. Clark v. Olson, 726 S.W.2d 718, 721 (Mo. 1987).

    It’s the same.  Most laws I’ve seen are more or less the same everywhere.