Did Viking offer enough for my missed connection?

Barbara Shurr’s European riverboat cruise was “wonderful” — until the very end.

That’s when she and her husband boarded a flight back home that they should have never been booked on, turning their dream cruise vacation into a nightmare.

“The flight home was from Budapest connecting through Rome to O’Hare to San Francisco,” she says. “The problem was they only gave us an hour to connect in Rome. This is an illegal connection since you need two hours to connect, and there was no way we could get between gates in different terminals in just one hour.”

The Shurrs had booked her entire vacation, including her airline tickets, directly through Viking River Cruises. She trusted the cruise line to make reservations that she could, you know, actually use.

When she received her documents, Shurr noticed the tight connection time in Rome, and contacted Viking.

I told a representative I wanted to change the flights, and she said cost $400. She tried to connect me with the reservations department, but she couldn’t get through.

She told me to try again later, which I did, but still couldn’t get through.

I assumed that Viking air dept was professional and knew what they were doing, so I finally gave up.

You know what happened next, right?

I’ll let Shurr tell us in her own words.

When we got to the Alitalia gate in Rome, we were there 20 minutes before the flight, and the gate agent told us the flight was closed and we would have to take the flight the next day.

We went out to the ticket counter, and they wanted to charge us $6,000 for the next day’s flight. I managed to talk them into honoring our tickets for the next day, but they would not pay for a hotel room or any food.

After we finally got home, I called Viking and they said, “Call the insurance company.” Which I did.

I filled out the claim form which said not to expect a response for four weeks. After 5 weeks I called them and was told the claim had been denied because the planes were “on time.”

She phoned Viking, explaining that she’d tried to get them to fix the problem before her cruise, and that her claim had been denied on a technicality.

Viking offered a $500 cruise credit, but that doesn’t begin to cover her out-of-pocket expenses, which total $1,213 for a hotel, rebooking her domestic flight and a cab ride to the airport.

“I would like to see Viking take responsibility for their air department error and reimburse us,” she says.

That sounded reasonable, so I contacted Viking on her behalf. A few weeks later, I heard from Shurr, who said a customer service representative had contacted her to apologize and offer two more $500 cruise credits.

She’s unhappy.

It’s empty gesture on their part which costs them nothing, and makes me mad.

The only way these vouchers are any good is if you take another cruise on Viking, which would end up costing us another $8,000 at least.

Why would we want to spend all that money for $1000 credit?

Why, indeed?

Here’s the bottom line: If Viking booked these airline tickets, then it should have made darned sure they were legal connections. It appears that at least two mistakes were made on these reservations: First, the illegal connection times; and second, the reservations don’t appear to be linked. (If they were, then they wouldn’t have had to pay for their domestic flight changes.)

The only fault I can find with Shurr is that she didn’t insist Viking address this obvious problem before she left. The rest, as far as I can tell, is on Viking.

Is its response to her, and to me, appropriate? I’m not so sure.

  • DavidYoung2

    Not sure if it needs to be cash, but Viking needs either to offer cash or enough credit that the OP is satisfied.  Either way is fine so long as the OP feels the deal is fair.

  • travelagentman

    Did she book through an agent or directly with Viking? An agent would have caught this error in 5 seconds. Viking looks at the cheapest way that they can transport people and that is it! I correct their errors monthly and never have a surcharge. When the error was discovered, action had to be taken immediately and the heck with the air department being busy; you just stay on hold until it is corrected. Viking massed up, but the clients were too un-educated to deserve a refund.

  • travelagentman

    She did not use a travel agent and was not interested in holding for the air department. You can not be that liberal to trust things will work out.

  • travelagentman

    I read things quite differently. Viking has a contract for various airlines and is not considered a travel agent. The local cruise lines could give a rip as to the flights that they book; it is always referred to insurance or tough luck.

  • TonyA_says

    Oh  my goodness, it’s worse than I thought. In that case, the passengers should just shop around for a competent TA. They are getting the wrong impression thinking that just because the buy from the cruise line, they are getting the same quality as dealing with a TA.

  • TonyA_says

    The thing that got my ears to  stand up here was the fact that the cruise rep told the OP she could not get in touch with the (air) reservations department. Why??? Maybe Travelagentman is correct, that Viking simply contracts out the air tickets. In that case, what kind of quality control is there? Maybe none.

    The other thing that got me here is why a 4-segment flight from BUD-SFO was necessary when there are many 2-segment flights? Also the route BUD-FCO-ORD-SFO almost guarantees cutting across multiple Airline Alliances (something a bit crazy nowadays).

    Personally, I could not put a (single) ticket for this specific route together without the pax staying overnight somewhere. Maybe others can.

    I don’t think this is an issue of minimum connection time from a technical perspective since MCT assumes a THROUGH CHECK IN of both passenger and baggage.

    IMO something else is wrong here since the airline (Alitalia) was not too helpful to reaccommodate them from the get go. Also the insurance company said the flights were on time. Nevertheless, the too many loose ends here makes me point my finger to the one that sold the airline ticket – Viking. I don’t think it is reasonable for customers to expect garbage (the 4-segment flight from BUD-SFO) from a company like Viking.

  • TonyA_says

    Maybe I have the wrong GDS or I don’t know how to use one, but I could not even get my GDS to do BUD-FCO-ORD-SFO with AZ nonstop FCO-ORD. I wonder how Viking did this? Maybe I need some training from them :-)

  • TonyA_says

    Maybe I have the wrong GDS or I don’t know how to use one, but I could not even get my GDS to do BUD-FCO-ORD-SFO with AZ nonstop FCO-ORD. I wonder how Viking did this? Maybe I need some training from them :-)

  • TonyA_says

    I think what Chris is trying to say is that one will need about 2 hours to connect between an “unspecified carrier” from Budapest (BUD) to Alitalia International (to ORD) flight in FCO because the flights were on separate tickets.

    The terms minimum connection time (MCT), legal connection, and separate tickets should not be used together. All bets are off when one has separate tickets.

    This article could have been a lot less confusing had we know which airline was flown from BUD-FCO and whether that flight was on a separate ticket.

  • TonyA_says

    A couple of loose ends need to be clarified:

    Malev used to fly MA400 depart BUD 725AM, arrive FCO 905AM.

    Remember Malev went belly up only last February, so it’s possible the OP took this early Malev flight to Rome and tried to connect with AZ628 departing 10AM. If these connecting flights were on the same ticket, meaning INTERLINED, then the connection would have been “legal” since the FCO Minimum Connection Time for intl-to-intl is only 45 minutes.

    It is possible to have many flights booked in ONE PNR (Reservation) and have the flights ticketed SEPARATELY.

    A GDS will not stop an agent from booking (seemingly unrelated airlines’) flights so your itinerary looks complete. However, due to fare rules and restrictions, lack of eticketing agreements, or to MINIMIZE fares, the flights within one PNR can be ticketed separately (meaning flights will have different e-ticket numbers and plated by different airlines). In other words, do not assume that just because you see the flights in one PNR/itinerary, it follows that they are all connected and interlined together.

    Separate tickets are ‘technically’ not using interlining (unless the airline checking you in and those after agree to check you and your bags through all the way).

    It is important that passengers flying multiple-segment and open-jaw flights, or when airlines from different alliances are used, to inspect their documents carefully and check which airline issued which e-ticket. If you want a smooth INTERLINE THROUGH CHECK-IN (IATCI) for yourself and your bags, make sure ONE AND ONLY ONE AIRLINE ticketed the whole journey.

  • TonyA_says

    Sirwired, I took some time to read their website.  Nothing is said about FLIGHT CHANGE FEES.
    The air deviation fee is something else:

    Deviate to an alternate destination city or stay extra time before or after your cruise or cruisetour.

    http://www.vikingrivercruises.com/about-your-trip/vikingairplus.aspx

  • TonyA_says

    I researched this more. It looks like Viking is operating an agency for airlines.
    Go to   http://www.vikingrecruitment.com/our_team/news

    Look at Caroline Law’s job description:

    The sourcing and booking of travel arrangements required by Vikings clients is Caroline’s responsibility.

    Using our in house flight booking system, she is able to search all major airlines for the most competitive Marine air fares and systems.

    Caroline brings with her experience from an executive business travel company in which she supervised a team of travel consultants by utilising her wide range of air fare knowledge and experience. She has ABTAC and IATA qualifications.

  • sirwired

     I really doubt it was a $400 flight change fee.  (“$400 for the new flights” is very different from “a $400 change fee”.)

    They likely started with Viking Standard Air, which is traditional cruise air.  (i.e. a pile of whatever bargain consolidator-rate airfares Viking has pieced together.  Cruises get decent prices for consolidator tickets because of the direct-from-airline large-ish volume they drive.  This is why they have a limited selection of gateway cities… drives more volume on specific flights.)

    If you don’t like your routing, stopovers, whatever, you pay $50 a head (the Air Deviation Fee, a.k.a. Viking Air Plus) plus fare difference, whatever that is; in this case the total came to $400-ish.

    Sounds like a booking fee + fare difference to me.  Not a $400 change fee.

  • TonyA_says

    Also after further digging, I am now seeing the possibility that the BUD-FCO could be an Alitalia codeshare flight from Malev (before Malev stopped operating on 2FEB12). If that is true, then the BUD-FCO-ORD could easily be on one Alitalia ticket and then the ORD-SFO was simply an add-on (to the Alitalia ticket).

    So now, I want to see proof of separate tickets. I want to see why they were not checked in at BUD all the way through to at least ORD. If they were, then so what if they got to the gate 20 minutes before scheduled departure? AZ would have known this and rush them through.

    Still a lousy routing BUD-FCO-ORD-SFO but they (Viking) probably got a good bulk rate from Alitalia.

  • TonyA_says

    Bodega, I am now inclined to think something else (weird) happened here. There is a big possibility that her ticket was an AZ CODESHARE (on Malev) from BUD to FCO and connecting to AZ FCO to ORD. If that is the case, then MALEV should have checked them through all the way to ORD or SFO. If they were checked through then even if the arrived at the gate in Terminal 3 about 20 minutes before scheduled departure, AZ would have helped them since all they need to do is board the aircraft.

    So now I am wondering why they were most likely NOT checked through from BUD. This is the main problem and there is a lack of information why it happened.

  • TonyA_says

    No Kathy, it’s the airlines that are notorious for joining together flight segments that are so close to the Minimum Connection Time. By the way, CDG (at least for Air France) has INCREASED its MCT to 90 minutes between Terminal 2 gates. It used to be only 60 minutes. Maybe they heard all the grumblings from passengers.

  • Bill Armstrong

    The fact that something happens pretty much means viking did something stupid.  The passenger tried to correct it, and Viking only wanted more money.  Fortunately, the passenger was able to get the airline to allow the ticket to be used the next day.  I dont’ think the insurance company should cover Viking’s inability to book a trip properly.

    A credit on a future trip is not cash.  The hotel cost cash.  The passenger already had to pay.  Viking should be required to refund each and every cost the passenger incurred, in cash…and there should be some punitive damages for “pain, stress and suffering” too.

  • andi330

    The problem with offering credit on a future purchase, regardless of industry, is that the business owner is arrogantly assuming that the upset customer intends to continue to patronize them. It is also something that is, in my experience, something fairly unique to the travel industry. Other businesses offer credits yes, but not like this, and usually not on products that cost as much as travel does. A cruise is not cheap. Many people may only take one in a life time as that big one time adventure that they’ll never be able to afford again. Offering a credit on a future use is something that the travel industry likes to do because they know many of the people they give it to will never use it, so it ultimately costs them nothing. 

    The article indicates that the two plane tickets were not linked in the system, which is what ultimately caused the OP to miss her connection. If they had been linked, the plane likely would have been held for them to board, because the airline would have known they were coming. Since there were 20 minutes until take-off the OP may have missed boarding by less than 5 minutes. Viking booked the tickets, and they should have made sure the itineraries were linked so that this wouldn’t happen, even knowing (as we do now) that the amount of time for connection was legal.

    If Viking did link the tickets, then they should be helping the customer prove that the tickets were linked, so that the customer can seek compensation from the airline instead. They acted as a travel agent for the customer by booking her plane tickets, they should have to help her clean up any messes just like a regular agent. The fact that they are offering a “goodwill gesture” instead of doing this indicates to me that they know the missed connection was caused by their mistake and they are hoping the customer will take a credit and go away, rather than take responsibility for the financial hardship they caused this customer.

  • bodega3

    I want to know why the OP didn’t know of the flights booked until the documents arrived.  I always get an itinerary by email as soon as the air is booked. 

  • bodega3

    There are too many missing factors right now to say the cruise line, as you put it, did something stupid.  It appears that they booked a legal connect.  If indeed that was the case, the cruise line is being very generous with a discount on a future cruise IMHO.

  • bodega3

    This tactic of future credits is used in all type of businesses and is a goodwill gesture for the customer to try them again.  The offer isn’t admitting they did anything wrong.  We all know the saying that the squeaky wheel gets the grease. 

    We don’t know if there was an OSI message sent notifying the two carriers of the two PNR’s.  I do this all the time when two carriers can not or should not be ticketed together.  Are you a ticketing TA?  If so, then you know that when you place all segments in one PNR and run the ticket as one, the most restrictive rules apply to the entire PNR.  It is often to the travelers benefit to not do this.  We also don’t know all the carriers and if they could be ticketed together. 

    As of right now, it doesn’t appear that there was any mistake made.  Prove it if you can.  With the information provided, this was a legal connect.  I have stated more times that I can count, a legal connect isn’t necessarily a reasonable connect but so often we don’t have many options if the segments are married by the carrier and this is becoming increasingly the case for a low fare.

  • bodega3

    This tactic of future credits is used in all type of businesses and is a goodwill gesture for the customer to try them again.  The offer isn’t admitting they did anything wrong.  We all know the saying that the squeaky wheel gets the grease. 

    We don’t know if there was an OSI message sent notifying the two carriers of the two PNR’s.  I do this all the time when two carriers can not or should not be ticketed together.  Are you a ticketing TA?  If so, then you know that when you place all segments in one PNR and run the ticket as one, the most restrictive rules apply to the entire PNR.  It is often to the travelers benefit to not do this.  We also don’t know all the carriers and if they could be ticketed together. 

    As of right now, it doesn’t appear that there was any mistake made.  Prove it if you can.  With the information provided, this was a legal connect.  I have stated more times that I can count, a legal connect isn’t necessarily a reasonable connect but so often we don’t have many options if the segments are married by the carrier and this is becoming increasingly the case for a low fare.

  • TonyA_says

    According to Viking …
    Flights can be reserved up to 320 days prior to departure, and flight schedules will be released 75 days prior to departure. While airline reservations are made when deposits and Passenger
    Information Forms (PIFs) are received, Viking River Cruises air
    department generally issues airline tickets 45 days prior to departure.

    According to OP …
    When she received her documents, Shurr noticed the tight connection time in Rome, and contacted Viking.

    So, did she know about the tight connection 75 days out or 45 days out? At what point did she complain? If the latter, them it was too late to fix it without penalty.

    Of course my assumption is that Viking sold an INTERLINED ticket connection with a legal MCT. (Based on my new research, I am inclined to believe they did sell a Malev flight which was INTERLINED to AZ and had 55 minutes connection time – 10 minutes over the 45 min. MCT.) If this is correct, then her complaints were either too late or IRRELEVANT.

    However, it is the lack of automatic reaccommodation in FCO and the US domestic return flight segments that bugs me. (Note, she bought a new domestic ticket.) Something is wrong! Lots of IFs, too many.

  • Keystonetraveler

    I have traveled several times a year for many years. More often than not when I travel on a cruise (or an escorted tour), I purchases my air independently of the cruise. However, sometimes there are some good prices from the cruise company and I will make my purchase with them. But I first go on the Internet and find the itinerary I want. Then my TA will request that itinerary. In most cases, my request is honored. I’ve saved money and I am happy. Note that some companies make a charge for such special requests, but they are typical minimal and usually not levied if the flights cannot be booked.

    Some companies do not take specific requests and may or may not come up with an itinerary or airline that I like. Usually, I can reject the booking if I don’t like it without any charge as long as I do so within 24 or 48 hours. Then, I can book what I want on my own.

    I always check the practices of the company before I try to book with them. My one experience with Viking was the least satisfactory one I have had with any company. I had traveled with them previously, but had booked my own airfare because I was spending some extra time in Europe. So, the next time I wanted to travel with them, I explored also booking the air with them. First, they would take no special requests. Second, if I didn’t like what they
    came up with, there would be cancellation fee ($300, I think) if I did not accept what they came up with. Third, I felt the person I dealt with was rude. The result: I booked a different trip and have never gone back to Viking.

  • TonyA_says

    Regarding your Viking experience, when they tried to charge you the $300 – was this BEFORE any tickets were actually issued? They can simply make RESERVATIONS without ticketing them. (Note some airlines will EXTEND the ticketing period for a longer time.) Then at some point later they will ticket the reservations.
    If this is the case, then the $300 was too much, since if no tickets have been issued yet, then the are no airline penalties to pay for.

  • lorcha

    This is really frustrating to me, because there are obviously some extremely knowledgeable and talented TAs who post here who know exactly how to get this type of trip done right for the traveler, but I have no idea how to find one that is local to me! 

    I’ve tried a few times, but all I got were dufuses who had no expertise over my just going out to Orbitz, and then tried to hard-sell me to buy all kinds of unlicensed travel protection plans and other “value adds”. Thanks, but no thanks.

  • lorcha

    I think the jury is still out on this one as to who dropped the ball. If Viking was in the right, how come the traveler couldn’t speak to someone about the air?

  • lorcha

    Heheh. I love it. When the TA effs up, it’s “This is why you should book independently,” and when the traveler effs up, it’s, “This is why you should us a TA!”

    Hopefully that was the point you were trying to make, and I just missed it. :)

  • lorcha

    “Insurance” carrier states flights were on time.

  • CherylAE

    I think for most people, a Viking Cruise is a trip of your life, not an everyday occurrence!   I agree with cash or a considerably higher credit.

  • TonyA_says

    I read that, too (but would like to see some proof); so the next issue is whether the flights on same ticket (or INTERLINED)?

    IMO they were. I think the OP was on AZ7525 a code share of Malev MA400 (now defunct and not operating airline).

    If both are true – inbound flight on time AND the OP was on AZ7525, then VIKING sold flights with ‘legal’ connection.

    If MALEV failed to check them THROUGH in Budapest, then that is NOT really Viking’s fault.

    Remember there are a lot of IFs in my statements. But the one thing I am sure of is that the route is lousy BUD-FCO-ORD-SFO. If an agent really cares for his customer, s/he would have sold something a lot better (see options on my other post).

  • Keystonetraveler

    This is what they told me would happen if they made a reservation. They said that if I did not like the reservation, I could cancel it but there would be the cancellation charge. That is when I decided to not make a reservation with them and booked a trip with someone else.

  • TonyA_says

    Wow that’s pretty nasty! A reservation is FREE. Does not cost me much (except perspiration) to do one. I can understand why they would charge to change a TICKET because of airline penalties, but a RESERVATION without a ticket, naah.