100,000 miles, $194 and a one-week delay — and you offer this?

To fly from San Francisco to Paris last month, Kenneth Cook forked over 100,00 miles and paid a $194 fee 10 months before his scheduled flight. The routing wasn’t ideal — it sent him via Denver and Frankfurt, but for that, he was getting choice seats in the front of the plane.

The least he expected was the see his luggage at the end of the journey, and that if he didn’t, the airline would take care of everything.

It didn’t.

As he sipped his glass of champagne, waiting for his Denver-bound flight to take off, the captain made an announcement that “delays of over an hour were anticipated, due to the need to remove 10,000 gallons of fuel, which required getting a truck to the gate,” he says.

He tried to tell a crewmember that he would need to get off the flight and reschedule, but the attendant was “grossly incompetent” and failed to get the bag off his original flight.

His new flight took him from Heathrow to Paris on Air France.

Of course, my luggage was not in Paris. I followed the [claims] process with the AirFrance staff, and received a tracking number, a T-shirt, a razor and a tooth brush, with the information that, if I didn’t have luggage in 24 hours, I was authorized to spend up to 100 euros.

As I was in Paris only overnight, they were going to deliver my bag to my hotel in Avignon.

The bag didn’t arrive within 24 hours, and Cook had to keep moving. He caught a train to Goult, France and when he arrived, he bought a few essentials, including 3 polo shirts, socks and underwear.

“I hoped for the best,” he says.

That proved to be overly optimistic. His bag didn’t arrive until a week after his arrival in France.

When I received my alternate routing in San Francisco, I was handed a card apologizing for the inconvenience, and offered “compensation” if processed online. They offered a choice of two discount coupons (with imitations) or 3,000 frequent flyer miles. When I tried to escalate, I was pushed into a message capturing queue.

Mostly, Cook is puzzled. The refund for the missed clothing must be processed through Delta, which is an Air France partner in the United States. However, he’s also been offered a separate compensation through United. What’s more, since his flight was delayed by more than three hours, EU 264 might apply to his situation.

“I feel United really messed up on this, and 3,000 miles is insultingly puny,” he says. “While I earned this trip, it did, in the long run, cost me significantly to accumulate that many miles, and it did cost me to redeem the award.”

Is your head spinning yet? Mine is.

I suggested he push this issue with all the airlines involved (and really, there are too many) which he did.

Final outcome? Delta and Air France quickly refunded the $124 he spent on clothes. He was happy about that. United upped the amount of compensation to an electronic certificate for $100, good for a year.

“Even my travel agent, with whom I shared this information, found the amount paltry and insulting,” he says.

Is it enough? Well, technically, United was only transporting Cook from San Francisco to Denver. And under U.S. regulations, it doesn’t owe him anything. Carrier #2 — and not to confuse the issue — is Lufthansa. It didn’t suffer any delays and didn’t lose his luggage, yet it probably owns his original ticket. That ticket was transferred to Delta and Air France after the delay. Yet at the same time, Cook is a United frequent flier and used his United miles to buy the tickets.

So is this enough compensation? From one perspective, it’s more than enough. From another, it’s hardly enough. But I’m not really sure which perspective to take.

  • bodega3

    Yes, this doesn’t make sense.

  • lost_in_travel

    If all the flights were on the same ticket would the EU regulations apply?  I don’t know.  On a multi-flight ticket, would domestic flights have US rules, EU flights have EU rules, but who governs the flight between?  Sorry, but I am ignorant about this.

  • TonyA_says

     Codeshare is hard enough. What more going over to the enemy?

  • lvswhippets

    I was on a flight from Heathrow to LAX. One passenger did not board so his luggage was removed right before we left. Also this past April I had a VERY short connection in Heathrow onward to LAX. Had arrived only 1 hr before from Amsterdam. I would never have made it without help but my luggage got on with me fine.

  • bodega3

    A US carrier from a US airport to an EU country doesn’t have the EU Passenger Rights protection, same in return.  The carrier has to be an EU based carrier.   

  • TonyA_says

     Could this be one of those credit card miles award?
    The routing SFO-LHR-CDG without LH on LHR-FRA/MUC-CDG is very weird on Star Alliance.

  • MarkKelling

    How about he wanted the flights he ended up on anyway but they were not available for the miles he wanted to spend?  Since SFO LHR CDG is a usually shorter route time wise than SFO DEN FRA CDG, who would NOT want that routing?  The fueling delay was just a convenient excuse to try to get what he originally wanted.  The fact that he then had lost luggage to be compensated for is just icing.

  • TonyA_says

    Interesting since AF never really tagged his bag or had possession of his bag since the bag never made it to the LHR-CDG leg nor the SFO-LHR UA leg. The bag was probably in DENVER. From there it had to catch up with him.

  • bayareascott

    UA does not serve champagne in first class on domestic flights, so if he was sipping champagne, he certainly was not on UA from SFO-DEN.  Champagne is only served on international flights.  

    This story *really* does not make sense.

  • bayareascott

    Exactly correct.

  • bayareascott

    Again, UA does not serve champagne on domestic flights.  If he claims he was onboard UA SFO-DEN “sipping champagne” and has to lie/exaggerate about even that detail, I’m not trusting the rest of his story.

  • bodega3

    This would make more sense.  I was thinking UA FF miles, but with credit cards, you cash in your earned points for an award ticket, so yes, that could be endorsed over as those have a cash value.

  • bayareascott

    Comments seem to not be loading.  Again, UA does not serve champagne on domestic flights.  If this customer claims to be “sipping champagne” on SFO-DEN and needs to lie/exaggerate about this type of detail, then I am not buying the rest of his story either.

  • bayareascott

    Exactly correct.

  • TonyA_says

    Need airline emp to help us here

    Last 8MAY,
    UA316 was scheduled to depart SFO 1:00 PM and arrive DEN 4:34 PM.
    The next flight LH447 was scheduled to depart 550PM. The minimum connection time is 35 minutes.

    Looking at the historical records, the airline filed the below changes (at SFO Pacific Time):
    12:55PM Estimated Gate Arrival Changed From 04:44 PM To 05:14 PM
    1:18 PM Estimated Gate Arrival Changed From 05:14 PM To 05:29 PM
    1:32 PM Estimated Gate Arrival Changed From 05:29 PM To 05:44 PM
    1:56 PM Estimated Gate Arrival Changed From 05:44 PM To 05:59 PM
    2:13 PM Estimated Gate Arrival Changed From 05:59 PM To 06:09 PM
    2:21 PM Estimated Gate Arrival Changed From 06:09 PM To 06:29 PM
    2:34 PM Estimated Gate Arrival Changed From 06:29 PM To 06:44 PM
    2:56 PM Estimated Gate Arrival Changed From 06:44 PM To 06:59 PM
    3:06 PM STATUS-Active  Actual Gate Departure Changed To 03:05 PM

    So by 118PM, he would have had an “illegal” connection (since the scheduled arrival was changed to 529PM). My question is about INVOL reroute. At what point can the passenger invoke it? Can someone already boarded simply stand up, deplane and ask to be reaccommodated?

    I don’t know the SOPs at the gate. Please explain. Thanks.

    By the way, I don’t have much sympathy about his misrouted luggage under this kind of situation. If you stand up and deplane, then your bags can easily get misrouted. The last time this happened to me, the airline unloaded all our bags at  the carousel (at the same airport we checked in), we claimed them,  and then recheck them in again. All old bags tags had to be removed. (Note this was in JFK in an iternational customs area, so you can imagine the complexity of reclaiming a bag you just checked in an hour ago.)

  • TonyA_says

     Also on a completely new [re]route, I believe you need to recheck your bags and get new tags. I could be wrong but this is what happened to me.

  • TonyA_says

    Another possibility was his bag was UNLOADED at SFO but he did not claim it. He essentially got re-issued a new ticket at SFO and MAYBE he needed to re-checked his luggage again at that point. Emphasis on the MAYBE.

  • TonyA_says

    Was he waiting at the lounge or a bar waiting for the delayed boarding? I wonder.

  • mikegun

    Except Chris states that he used his UA FF miles…2nd to last paragraph, last sentence.

  • TonyA_says

    I know you are an Expert on UA awards. Can he have taken an LH transatlantic on UA awards. Isn’t that a codeshare? Is that allowed when UA has it’s own SFO-FRA flight?

    I really think the ticket was on LH stock. Me thinks he got a credit card award ticket (i.e. Capitol One, AMEX, or Chase Sapphire. etc.).
    That is the only way he could have got one reissued the same day and create such weird [flexible] routing.
    If that was an airline award ticket, he probably would be stuck at Denver or SFO. What you think?

  • bodega3

    Yep…darn!  Now back to square one and trying to understand how an award ticket gets signed over to a carrier that isn’t part of UA’s ff program. 

  • mikegun

    I wonder if he booked way in advance and used his CO miles…would that have made a difference? I don’t recall their partners.

  • travelagentman

    There are very specific international laws on amounts to be paid for lost luggage, and the final airline assumes all liability for delivery, whether their fault or not. Take more action!

  • emanon256

    You can get Star Alliance awards through United, even on competing routes. They are typically only available on LH, though sometimes they are available on AC.  The rate for a first class saver R/T award between the US and Europe is 135,000 miles (as of the re-alignment which was Q1 or Q2 2011).  So either he went business class, which would be 100,000, or he was using some type of credit card like you mentioned.  I do find it hard to believe that they would have re-booked him on Air France if it was if it was a UA Mileage award, but you never know.  I’ve been rebooked on American and Frontier before (Pre 3/3 Systems merger).  I’ve heard from fellow frequent flyers that United refused to re-book on another carrier since 3/3 due to system limitations, though I don’t entirely believe that it’s a system limitation.
     
    Oh, and as far as fuel, I have had several flights where they had to dump X,XXX pounds of fuel due to weather, routing, etc.  I would hardly call that an escalating delay 30 minutes is usually the longest I have seen.  It does take longer to empty than fill, but if he was sitting on an SFO-DEN domestic flight it was mostly likely an A320/319 or B752.  The 725 holds barely over 10,000 Gallons, and the ABIs hold less than 10,000.  So I assume he heard pounds and is saying gallons.

    Edit: Removed info that Tony cleared up below.

  • emanon256

    CO switched to Star Alliance over 2 years ago, and by the timing in the story he would have booked it July 2011.

  • mikegun

    That’s right. I think they were Skyteam, but it’s been awhile.

  • Lindabator

    Agreed – WAY too many questions on what flights, where the delay was, who booked the new schedule, etc etc etc.  Too foggy for a good answer here!

  • Lindabator

    Fully interchangeable between UA/LH.  Since this was an awards ticket I have NO IDEA why he would have been offered (if he was) Delta/Air France to replace?  Too many questions on this one! 

  • Lindabator

    Because if he was on a free ticket on UA/LH, WHY did he end up on DL/AF?  Just not something you would see, as UA has to pay out cash for that ticket.  And he really is unclear about how long the delay would be, and why they couldn’t just re-route the SFO-DEN flight. 

  • Kevin Mathews

    Chris,
    I think you need to step in here and clear up the exact sequence of events.
    From reading the article it sounds like the following:
    Original Booking with United:
    SFO->DEN->FRA->CDG
    Flight From SFO->DEN was delayed.
    Rebooked by United on Delta and Air France
    SFO->LHR->CDG
    Fight went fine.  Luggage was lost in Transition between the airlines.
    I assume that Delta and AF Paid the Luggage because United did indeed transfer the luggage over to them, they just failed to move it timely.
    United paid him for the original delay in vouchers.

    While it sucks for him that his luggage was lost, Delta and AF did what they were required to do, and outside the original delay, United didn’t relaly do anything wrong here.  It’d be hard to ask for United to cough up more money for a mistake that they didn’t cause.  It’d be difficult to get anything further out of Delta or AF because he wasn’t their customer and bought his tickets using UNITED miles…

  • RetiredNavyphotog

    As soon as I saw the headline in my e-mail – and even before I clicked on the link – I knew United was involved.
    I am divorcing myself from United as soon as I use up my miles.  Good luck getting additional compensation from United.
    There is a better chance of peace in the Middle East.

  • flutiefan

     no, positive bag match went out of style after 9/11.  it may surprise most people, but bags weren’t routinely screened before then. now we have 100% screening, wherein every bag has gone through the CTX or been searched by a TSA agent, and so as long as they pass the tests, they are allowed to go on any flight.

  • flutiefan

     no, it isn’t illegal for bags to fly without their human.  since 100% screening was implemented post-9/11, bags can be placed on any flight.  even before that when airlines had PPBM (Positve Passenger Bag Match), it was only on a select number of bags that were matched, not all.
    some airlines still stick to that system, and pull bags when the passenger doesn’t board.  but there are no legalities involved.

  • http://elliott.org Christopher Elliott

    OK, I’m going to have to follow up with Cook again. I told you this was confusing! 

    I think the bottom line for Cook is that with so many airline partners, it’s hard to know who is responsible for the substandard experience. He believes that whoever is responsible could do more.

    I think we probably have enough information to make that determination, and I can see many of you have already voted.

    I understand that some of you need more details on how he got to Paris. I’ll try to get those and will post an update when I get it.

    By the way, I’ve been traveling for the last few weeks, and Disqus is acting up (I don’t have a way of seeing the comments immediately when they post), which why I haven’t been as responsive. I’ll try to do better. :-)

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/4DMVW6EDML54CXFQMZHZCZ7WEY EmilyE

     If the airlines have enough notice they can pull them and retag them themselves.

  • AUSSIEtraveller

    why on earth do yanks think that is something goes wrong, it’s someone else’s fault apart from their own & they should be compensated ?

    Bloody lawyers. Shakespeare said centuries ago that we should shoot all the lawyers.

    No better time than the present.

    + Above is all the more reason to not check in bags.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=544971966 Samantha Dow

    unless it was a codeshare or maybe a holdover continental flight? I flew continental business first domestically a LOT in my old job and remember champagne as an option (largely because I always took that option!).

  • bayareascott

    “BusinessFirst” is the name of a cabin where there are lie-flat seats, typically on international routes.  I am not aware of traditional CO using that service on domestic routes.  In any case, SFO-DEN is UA hub-to-hub.

  • TonyA_says

     I went to United MP website and chose DEN-PAR. The LH447 flight appeared on the PARTNER flights.
    I can get Saver Award First for 50K and Standard Award First for 125k both have only $34.70 tax.

    Not sure where he got [more] than 100k and $194.

    When I entered SFO as my origin, I could not get the SFO-DEN-FRA-CDG route and partner flight section looks real puny.

    This is so weird.

  • emanon256

    I got the info off the Star Alliance award chart.  It’s on page 3: https://www.united.com/web/en-US/content/news/United_Award_Chart_2012-03-03.pdf  It says 50,000 miles per way, which it also lists on page 2 as Untied Saver awards.  When you choose the award, it says 50,000 until you choose the return, then it bumps it up to 100,000.  At least it did for me when I tried.
     
    The 50,000 one way you see is the price for Business. In the merger with Continental, they renamed business class to “Business First” and first class to “Global First.”  It’s quite confusing. They also charge the business rate for first class in a 2 cabin aircraft.  So if it’s a 2 cabin international plane like the CO ones, it will only have Business First and cost 50,000 miles, if it’s a 3 cabin international plane like the UA ones, it will have Business and Global First.  Than you connecting flights will all have Domestic First (Which I believe CO calls Business) regardless of the international flight being in Business or First.  Very confusing I know. So booking under what says First/Business First/Business is technically the old Business Class.  If he was booking a 2-cabin LH flight, it would only have what LH calls “Business” and “Economy” and cost 50,000 miles each way.  If it’s a 3 cabin LH, it would offer Economy, Business, or First.  LH still has very straight forward names for their cabins.  I flew EWR-MUC on LH once on an award, It was amazing compared to anything UA offers.  The food, the service, everything, was so much better. I hope to do it again one day, Business was so good on LH, I don’t care about first.  Unfortunately, very few star alliance awards are ever available.
     
    The OP may have called UA to book the SFO-DEN-FRA-CDG, they can do some creative bookings like that over the phone if you ask them.  You can also get stop overs for up to two days in each direction and still have it count as part of your one-way.  So you could do DEN-FRA stay for two days, and then FRA-CDG, stay for a week, then CDG to YYZ, stay for 2 days and YYZ to DEN, and only pay for one R/T ticket.  You can also throw in 1 open jaw while you’re at it.  Its nuts, and too risky in my book, if something goes wrong, it could have a lot of problems.

  • emanon256

    I wish I could like this post more than once!

    No offence to the lawyers.

    I like the part about why everyone has to blame someone else when something goes wrong and wants compensation for it. Sometimes stuff just happens.

  • TonyA_says

    Wow I am so confused. I give up on United.

  • emanon256

    I fly them around 125,000 miles a year, personally know a former FA as a close friend, was fraternity brothers and still friends with their director of in-flight experience (Who I have not heard hide nor tail from since the merger was official), and it still took a long time for me to figure it out (what little I know).  I can see how it would be confusing as heck for a regular non-frequent flyer to figure it out.  I think the OP was savvy in this case, and it still bit him in the butt.
     
    Also the new United requires cover sheets on all of the TPS reports, in case no one got the memo :-)

  • Joe Farrell

     I will be happy to send you a photo and a name / model number if you contact me at comanchepilot [at] gmail [dot] com

    It is so popular that someone going to the east coast for job interview for 2 days borrowed it over the weekend and is scheduled to return it tomorrow –

  • jet2x2

    Why on earth does everyone have to misquote the Bard to bash lawyers?  

  • Joe Farrell

    but as Tony pulled up the flight was almost 3 hours late – so if he did NOT get up and get off the airplane he would have MISSED his connection in DEN and would have likely gotten to JFK where he would have spent the night for the AM flight to Paris . . . 

  • jim6555

    According to Chris, it was a UA/AF codeshare flight.
    “Actual routing: UA930/Air France 2281 to CDG”

  • TonyA_says

    Never did much on UA. As a NYC person, UA didn’t have much to offer me or my clients. CO did something for us since they have pretty decent flights from EWR. Hence, that’s the only reason I’m even paying some attention.

    I need UA flights to haul my inland pax to intl gateways but that is causing continous headaches. Changes galore. Your time is eaten up contacting clients.

  • TonyA_says

    The one that sold the ticket.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_UES4TUPI6NRPTG2DCB4YCX6R4U wyoming1949

    The bottom line is that Cook had a right to expect his luggage would be at his first stop in Europe.  That didn’t happen and THEN the airline had him waiting a WEEK!  He deserves to be compensated in CASH–not in worthless vouchers or miles.  Having said that I would have NEVER checked ANY bags—even with the original itinerary.  Two connections is, essentially, ASKING to have your luggage lost.  Changing the itinerary, once your journey has begun, almost guarantees it.  This is another example of how airline miles are close to being worthless.  Cook handed-over 100,000 miles, and he STILL couldn’t get a non-stop SFO – CDG flight!  Add to that the aggravation of having to wait a week for his luggage.  I’d rather purchase a fully refundable “economy plus” ticket; fly non-stop; tell the airline to keep their stupid miles and to put them where the sun doesn’t shine!